Feminist Conversation Circles
Post-Presidential Elections: Reactions of AAPI Women
September 2017
This Conversation Circle topic was about the impact of the change of administration on AAPI women. Our Conversation Circle participants were:
Themes that emerged:
Reactions to the election:
Participants felt a range of emotional and visceral reactions to the election. They outlined emotions of anger, fear, exhaustion, trauma and feeling like an act of violence has been perpetrated on those with marginalized identities. Participants also identified feeling a lack of trust for those in majority identities (like white women). In addition, participations described sometimes having difficulty concentrating and having difficulty processing the results. On a positive note, participants reported that the election has also made the discrimination that those in various marginalized identities face more visible and more difficult to dismiss. For example, in professional and personal spaces, it is now impossible to ignore ways in which discrimination is real and is often blatant and aggressive. Its every day form as microaggressions is also every present, and it is the everyday experiences that others cannot ignore.
Greater awareness and solidarity:
Positive changes that have resulted from the change in administration have been a greater spotlight on discrimination and social injustices, which has led to a deeper sense of solidarity among minorities/oppressed identities and allies. Participants noted feeling validated by other people's strong reactions, and appreciating open conversations about injustices as well as people rallying together to fight against oppression.
Self care:
Participants shared that self care not only includes them but also their families and they have expanded the definition to include their families. Some strategies include taking the time for self care, expressing emotions as they arise as a way to model for children and students, finding ways to engage in supportive activities and talks with those in their communities, attending marches, sending letters or emails to the office of the president and continuing to dialogue. One difficulty can be to understand that those in transitional spaces (e.g, people transitioning out of school, those who are not in safe geographical spaces etc) may not have the privilege to have safe spaces, so it is important to create these spaces for those as well.
Paraphrased Transcript of Conversation:
Q1. How have you been impacted by the change of administration
Reactions of big question, where to begin etc.
DH: vacillating between anger, fear, exhaustion, hopelessness, trauma, shock, moving from emotion to emotion, things not making sense, self-preservation, but not feeling good about wanting to move away from the larger conversation
KD: violence in different ways. Notion of trauma and violence. For women and POC the undercurrent of violence to sense of trust and humanity, deep form of violence. No words to describe the feelings or emotions but feeling overwhelmed. Trying to fight back in different ways professionally and personally. Challenging to stay focused. Emotional experience is of being suffocated.
NN: Not being alone anymore after election. Before election feeling alone and isolated. Strong reactions from other people made me feel less alone.
SM: How the election took away the safety and growing up and reality checks as the debate of immigration and other identities have become more visibly targeted.
MK: Helpless to empowered. Positive changes of creating spaces where spaces can be created for dialogue, receiving support. Also frustration when only the blatant acts are the focus and not focus on systemic discrimination and/or microaggression. How to make professional judgments about how much of your own social justice orientation you bring to your work and your workplace. Finding a balance and choosing your battles. Feeling all over the place.
FN: Anger and frustration but also spaces to discuss what has been happening.
KD: Feeling less lonely. Solidarity with other racial groups like BLM. The blinders have been removed from white peoples' consciousness. Ugliness has been exposed so POC and other marginalized groups are being taken seriously. Systemic discrimination has been exposed and violence against marginalized groups has been exposed. Invisible is now visible. What to do about this now?
DH: Making invisible visible in a culturally congruent way and to give voice to different groups while being inclusive and not taking away any group's voice or agency. Not wanting to invalidate experiences. How to move forward in advocacy while being true to my own values.
NN: Relief on one hand of not being dismissed in class, but also facing the experience of racism and discrimination everyday. Things that were hidden are becoming more visible.
KD: Constant bombardment of the whole person in terms of intersectional identities. Caring for multiple groups, us our students, clients, family and dealing with family members who have different views can all feel like a hurricane and stability is tough and exhausting.
Q2. How are people taking care of yourself or avoiding burnout?
NN: Trying to figure out how to remain civil and learning new ways of coping since the rules have not changed.
DH: Network of people, safe spaces, community
SM: Finding community and stability when in a transitional space, for example early career psychologists, those in adjunct spaces etc. Not easy to build safe spaces in transitional places.
MK: Raw conversations with others without filtering or apologizing. Privilege of working in spaces where that is possible. Attending events, marches etc.
KD: Distrust of white people and fake white allies. How the election results have exposed fake allies and created mistrust against white people. How do you interact with those who put the president in office? How to trust those in majority spaces (WW specifically). Feeling betrayal and anger at the 25% of AAPI and 25% of Latinx voted for Trump.
NN: Changing the mindset around self care and feeling more entitled to self care. Health care as essential.
KD: Send an email to whitehouse.gov asking president to resign. Having voice heard, attending protest marches. Attending the march felt less isolating and gave trust that white people and others care about the issues. Eating chocolate, reading.
DH: Self care and normalizing emotions and exhaustion
September 2017
This Conversation Circle topic was about the impact of the change of administration on AAPI women. Our Conversation Circle participants were:
- Khanh Dinh – President Elect of Division 35 Section 5, Associate Professor at University of Massachusetts Lowell
- Diane Hayashino – Past President of Division 35 Section 5, Training Director at California State University Long Beach
- Malin Kimoto - Section 5 Newsletter Co-Chair, Staff Psychologist at Kaiser Richmond
- Nadine Nakamura - Associate Professor at University of La Verne
- Fanny Ng- Section 5 Graduate Student Representative
- Shruti Mukkamala - Staff Psychologist at University of California, Irvine
Themes that emerged:
Reactions to the election:
Participants felt a range of emotional and visceral reactions to the election. They outlined emotions of anger, fear, exhaustion, trauma and feeling like an act of violence has been perpetrated on those with marginalized identities. Participants also identified feeling a lack of trust for those in majority identities (like white women). In addition, participations described sometimes having difficulty concentrating and having difficulty processing the results. On a positive note, participants reported that the election has also made the discrimination that those in various marginalized identities face more visible and more difficult to dismiss. For example, in professional and personal spaces, it is now impossible to ignore ways in which discrimination is real and is often blatant and aggressive. Its every day form as microaggressions is also every present, and it is the everyday experiences that others cannot ignore.
Greater awareness and solidarity:
Positive changes that have resulted from the change in administration have been a greater spotlight on discrimination and social injustices, which has led to a deeper sense of solidarity among minorities/oppressed identities and allies. Participants noted feeling validated by other people's strong reactions, and appreciating open conversations about injustices as well as people rallying together to fight against oppression.
Self care:
Participants shared that self care not only includes them but also their families and they have expanded the definition to include their families. Some strategies include taking the time for self care, expressing emotions as they arise as a way to model for children and students, finding ways to engage in supportive activities and talks with those in their communities, attending marches, sending letters or emails to the office of the president and continuing to dialogue. One difficulty can be to understand that those in transitional spaces (e.g, people transitioning out of school, those who are not in safe geographical spaces etc) may not have the privilege to have safe spaces, so it is important to create these spaces for those as well.
Paraphrased Transcript of Conversation:
Q1. How have you been impacted by the change of administration
Reactions of big question, where to begin etc.
DH: vacillating between anger, fear, exhaustion, hopelessness, trauma, shock, moving from emotion to emotion, things not making sense, self-preservation, but not feeling good about wanting to move away from the larger conversation
KD: violence in different ways. Notion of trauma and violence. For women and POC the undercurrent of violence to sense of trust and humanity, deep form of violence. No words to describe the feelings or emotions but feeling overwhelmed. Trying to fight back in different ways professionally and personally. Challenging to stay focused. Emotional experience is of being suffocated.
NN: Not being alone anymore after election. Before election feeling alone and isolated. Strong reactions from other people made me feel less alone.
SM: How the election took away the safety and growing up and reality checks as the debate of immigration and other identities have become more visibly targeted.
MK: Helpless to empowered. Positive changes of creating spaces where spaces can be created for dialogue, receiving support. Also frustration when only the blatant acts are the focus and not focus on systemic discrimination and/or microaggression. How to make professional judgments about how much of your own social justice orientation you bring to your work and your workplace. Finding a balance and choosing your battles. Feeling all over the place.
FN: Anger and frustration but also spaces to discuss what has been happening.
KD: Feeling less lonely. Solidarity with other racial groups like BLM. The blinders have been removed from white peoples' consciousness. Ugliness has been exposed so POC and other marginalized groups are being taken seriously. Systemic discrimination has been exposed and violence against marginalized groups has been exposed. Invisible is now visible. What to do about this now?
DH: Making invisible visible in a culturally congruent way and to give voice to different groups while being inclusive and not taking away any group's voice or agency. Not wanting to invalidate experiences. How to move forward in advocacy while being true to my own values.
NN: Relief on one hand of not being dismissed in class, but also facing the experience of racism and discrimination everyday. Things that were hidden are becoming more visible.
KD: Constant bombardment of the whole person in terms of intersectional identities. Caring for multiple groups, us our students, clients, family and dealing with family members who have different views can all feel like a hurricane and stability is tough and exhausting.
Q2. How are people taking care of yourself or avoiding burnout?
NN: Trying to figure out how to remain civil and learning new ways of coping since the rules have not changed.
DH: Network of people, safe spaces, community
SM: Finding community and stability when in a transitional space, for example early career psychologists, those in adjunct spaces etc. Not easy to build safe spaces in transitional places.
MK: Raw conversations with others without filtering or apologizing. Privilege of working in spaces where that is possible. Attending events, marches etc.
KD: Distrust of white people and fake white allies. How the election results have exposed fake allies and created mistrust against white people. How do you interact with those who put the president in office? How to trust those in majority spaces (WW specifically). Feeling betrayal and anger at the 25% of AAPI and 25% of Latinx voted for Trump.
NN: Changing the mindset around self care and feeling more entitled to self care. Health care as essential.
KD: Send an email to whitehouse.gov asking president to resign. Having voice heard, attending protest marches. Attending the march felt less isolating and gave trust that white people and others care about the issues. Eating chocolate, reading.
DH: Self care and normalizing emotions and exhaustion
Applying to Graduate Programs in Psychology
June 2014
This Conversation Circle topic was on applying to graduate programs in psychology. Our participants were:
What are you looking for in a graduate program?
Loretta is looking for research-oriented clinical psychology Ph.D. programs because she really enjoys research. In her search process, she is considering the fit between her research interests and her advisor’s areas of expertise, the application requirements (e.g. GRE scores), and available funding that will meet her needs. She acknowledged that the process can be overwhelming at times. Jessica agreed that there are many components to consider in the search process. She is looking for programs with a scientist-practitioner model because she loves clinical work and she would like to develop her research skills. She has limited her search to programs that meet this criteria. Jenni applied to Ph.D. programs after her bachelor’s degree. She noticed that students in her program who came in with their masters degree seemed better prepared for the Ph.D. process. She was looking for programs that would be a good fit with her career goals and with her personality. During the application process, she contacted a few professors and graduate students to get to know them on a personal level. Sherry is a sophomore in an undergraduate and master’s combined program and is looking into clinical psychology Ph.D. programs that provides research opportunities with children and adolescents.
What surprised you about your graduate program?
Jenni was surprised that her program used a cohort model and selected them based on our fit with the program, with the advisors, and with each other. In Jenni's program, the students do not work very closely with their advisors and students often provide mentorship to each other. She was also surprised by her advisor’s mentorship style. Jessica agreed that in her master’s program, her faculty members have very different mentoring styles and research interests. For her Ph.D. program, she is looking for a mentor who can support and guide her through her development and who will take time to establish a relationship with her.
What makes a successful candidate for a Ph.D. program?
Loretta always knew that a Ph.D. was a big commitment and that she wanted to complete a’ master’s first. She was able to narrow down her interests in her master’s program. She knows now that she wants to fully commit to a Ph.D. program. Jessica applied to Ph.D. programs while she was in undergrad. She got a few interviews but did not receive an offer. On interviews, she saw that many of the applicants had master’s degrees. She said that that her master’s program has helped her develop her professional identity and interests. I think that faculty members are looking at a variety of qualifications and factors when selecting candidates and it is hard to predict the specific characteristics of a successful candidate.
How much emphasis do graduate programs put on research experiences with human subjects and clinical experiences with clients?
Both Loretta and Jessica agreed that it depends on the focus of the program and that a well-rounded application with both research and clinical work is important. Jenni's program is a counseling psychology program with an emphasis on clinical training. She thinks that her program looks for applicants with clinical experiences (either paid or volunteer) with diverse groups of people. Many of the students in her program have served as Peace Corps or AmeriCorps volunteers. Most people come in with prior research experiences. Publications are a plus. During interview, faculty members and current students are looking for applicants with strong interpersonal skills, professionalism, and fit with the program.
What are some of the challenges of studying for the GRE?
Loretta found the quantitative section to be challenging. She used a variety of books and resources to help her study. Both Loretta and Jessica suggested identifying strengths and areas of growth on the GRE. Jessica suggested studying on a regular basis rather than cramming for the tests. She learned 5 new words a day and use these new vocabulary to write stories. She also wrote one essay per week. Jenni took her GRE about 5 years ago. As an English as a second language learner, vocabulary and writing were her biggest challenges. She thought that the GRE scores depended more on test taking ability than content knowledge. She thought the workbooks and prep courses are helpful and give people an edge. Loretta found the psychology subject test to be time intensive and memorization-based and the test is expensive ($150).
What advice can you provide on the personal statement?
Most of our participants agreed that a successful personal statement balances between structure and flow, and between narrative and direct styles. For English as second language learners, there are added barriers in the application process due to cultural differences. To help improve her writing, Sherry asked for feedback from friends, read statement of purposes from successful applicants, and sought support from the writing center on campus. In the fall, she plans to take a cross-cultural communications class. Loretta learned how to write successful statements by reading examples from others, identifying the structures in these statements, and imitating their styles.
- Jessica Liu – psychology masters student at California State University Fullerton
- Loretta Hsueh – psychology masters student at San Diego State University
- Jennifer Chain – counseling psychology Ph.D. student at the University of Oregon
- Sherry Zou - sophomore at Saint John's University
What are you looking for in a graduate program?
Loretta is looking for research-oriented clinical psychology Ph.D. programs because she really enjoys research. In her search process, she is considering the fit between her research interests and her advisor’s areas of expertise, the application requirements (e.g. GRE scores), and available funding that will meet her needs. She acknowledged that the process can be overwhelming at times. Jessica agreed that there are many components to consider in the search process. She is looking for programs with a scientist-practitioner model because she loves clinical work and she would like to develop her research skills. She has limited her search to programs that meet this criteria. Jenni applied to Ph.D. programs after her bachelor’s degree. She noticed that students in her program who came in with their masters degree seemed better prepared for the Ph.D. process. She was looking for programs that would be a good fit with her career goals and with her personality. During the application process, she contacted a few professors and graduate students to get to know them on a personal level. Sherry is a sophomore in an undergraduate and master’s combined program and is looking into clinical psychology Ph.D. programs that provides research opportunities with children and adolescents.
What surprised you about your graduate program?
Jenni was surprised that her program used a cohort model and selected them based on our fit with the program, with the advisors, and with each other. In Jenni's program, the students do not work very closely with their advisors and students often provide mentorship to each other. She was also surprised by her advisor’s mentorship style. Jessica agreed that in her master’s program, her faculty members have very different mentoring styles and research interests. For her Ph.D. program, she is looking for a mentor who can support and guide her through her development and who will take time to establish a relationship with her.
What makes a successful candidate for a Ph.D. program?
Loretta always knew that a Ph.D. was a big commitment and that she wanted to complete a’ master’s first. She was able to narrow down her interests in her master’s program. She knows now that she wants to fully commit to a Ph.D. program. Jessica applied to Ph.D. programs while she was in undergrad. She got a few interviews but did not receive an offer. On interviews, she saw that many of the applicants had master’s degrees. She said that that her master’s program has helped her develop her professional identity and interests. I think that faculty members are looking at a variety of qualifications and factors when selecting candidates and it is hard to predict the specific characteristics of a successful candidate.
How much emphasis do graduate programs put on research experiences with human subjects and clinical experiences with clients?
Both Loretta and Jessica agreed that it depends on the focus of the program and that a well-rounded application with both research and clinical work is important. Jenni's program is a counseling psychology program with an emphasis on clinical training. She thinks that her program looks for applicants with clinical experiences (either paid or volunteer) with diverse groups of people. Many of the students in her program have served as Peace Corps or AmeriCorps volunteers. Most people come in with prior research experiences. Publications are a plus. During interview, faculty members and current students are looking for applicants with strong interpersonal skills, professionalism, and fit with the program.
What are some of the challenges of studying for the GRE?
Loretta found the quantitative section to be challenging. She used a variety of books and resources to help her study. Both Loretta and Jessica suggested identifying strengths and areas of growth on the GRE. Jessica suggested studying on a regular basis rather than cramming for the tests. She learned 5 new words a day and use these new vocabulary to write stories. She also wrote one essay per week. Jenni took her GRE about 5 years ago. As an English as a second language learner, vocabulary and writing were her biggest challenges. She thought that the GRE scores depended more on test taking ability than content knowledge. She thought the workbooks and prep courses are helpful and give people an edge. Loretta found the psychology subject test to be time intensive and memorization-based and the test is expensive ($150).
What advice can you provide on the personal statement?
Most of our participants agreed that a successful personal statement balances between structure and flow, and between narrative and direct styles. For English as second language learners, there are added barriers in the application process due to cultural differences. To help improve her writing, Sherry asked for feedback from friends, read statement of purposes from successful applicants, and sought support from the writing center on campus. In the fall, she plans to take a cross-cultural communications class. Loretta learned how to write successful statements by reading examples from others, identifying the structures in these statements, and imitating their styles.
Internship
February 2014
This Conversation Circle topic was about internship. Our Conversation Circle participants were:
What was your most memorable experience on internship?
Each of our participants completed their internship at different sites. Phi Loan, Yuying and Diane completed their internship at university counseling centers (UCCs), while Khanh completed her internship at a consortium that included a VA hospital, Indian Health Services, and a university hospital.
Phi Loan said her internship experience was powerful. It was her first time working in a counseling center; the training, people, and connection that she made during that year convinced her to pursue a career as a university counseling center psychologist. Yuying said that she also loved her experience working at a counseling center. Her internship helped her to better understand the operations of an agency. She enjoyed connecting with the staff and fellow interns and working with diverse student populations. Diane had her internship at a counseling center during 9/11. She remembered that the event was traumatic and the staff members mobilized quickly to serve the students. The relationships she established and the support that she received at a counseling center was a great fit for her needs. She credited her training director, an Asian American woman, for supporting her through the experience. Khanh had a very different experience on her internship in New Mexico. The consortium had 4-5 different rotations. Her favorite rotation was with Indian Health Services on the reservation because she was interested in gaining more clinical experience with diverse populations.
What were some challenges in your internship experience?
Most of our participants indicated that completing the internship while working on their dissertation as a real challenge. Diane was in the midst of collecting data when she went on internship. Halfway through her internship year, she realized that she will not be able to finish her dissertation. She was embarrassed when she informed her family that she will have to delay graduation. Looking back, she realized now that she had put a lot of pressure on herself to finish her dissertation on time. Phi Loan also struggled with completing her dissertation while on internship. She chose to focus only on her internship experience. In retrospect, she wished that she had given her dissertation more attention. She said that it was hard to say “no” to many amazing opportunities and maintain balance.
Khanh said that one of her biggest challenges was working with Vietnam vets at the VA. As a Vietnamese refugee and a lesbian woman, her and her clients’ identities and traumatic experiences were highlighted in the therapeutic relationship. There were a few times when she felt unsafe with clients who were experiencing psychotic episodes. She said the VA staff members did not know how to address issues of diversity and discrimination. She experienced homophobia from her colleagues and did not feel that she had the power to interrupt offensive remarks as an intern. In addition, the location of the internship offered her and her partner very little opportunities to socialize with others. Finally, Khan said the regular work schedule was challenging. She is not a morning person and having to wake up early every day was difficult.
Yuying said that waking up early on a regular basis was also hard for her and that she was drawn to a faculty position because the work schedule was more flexible. Yuying also said that hunting for jobs while on internship was challenging. Looking back, she wished that she eased the pressure on herself about getting a full time job right after internship; instead, she would have taken time to get her license first.
What makes a successful applicant?
As a training directors, Diane and Phi Loan said that they get this question a lot and it may be a sign that students are feeling very stressed and anxious about the application process. Diane said she looks for applicants who are ready to make the transition from student to professional. She wants students to bring their whole selves to internship in addition to their strong clinical and research background. She is looking for students who are comfortable with themselves and a good match for the site. She recommends applicants to take time to research the site to get to know the training and staff members. College counseling centers are looking for interns who have clinical experiences with different populations, not just with college students. At a UCC, she is looking for interns who are flexible and adjust quickly between responsibilities (e.g., seeing clients, consulting with departments, running groups, and providing outreach). Phi Loan also agreed that flexibility is an important characteristic for successful interns. She is looking for interns who can find a balance between being themselves and being a professional and who can create authentic connections. Applicants who are invested in their own training stand out to her.
Both Khanh and Yuying emphasized the fit between the person and the site. Khanh found that being the only ethnic minority person with White supervisors was challenging. She suggested that culturally sensitive supervisors can make a difference on internship. Khanh really wanted clinical experiences with a diverse population and she targeted internship sites that would provide her with this training. Yuying acknowledged that “fit” can seem like a mysterious concept. She said that Khanh’s strategy of choosing practicum experiences that matched her clinical interest is a great example of fit. She said during her graduate work, she choose to participate in an extra year of practicum in a college counseling center in order to work with API college students. She recommended applicants to look for internship that fits with their training needs and interests rather than settling with an internship just to finish the program.
What other advice would you give to students applying for internship?
Take a deep breath, said Phi Loan, it is an anxiety provoking experience. This is part of the whole clinical training. Be intentional about looking for an internship that fits with your identities and career goals. Bring yourself to the application. Diane said that the cover letter makes an important first impression. Take some time to talk about why the site is attractive and how it fits with your training goals. Make sure someone else proof read your cover letters and essays. Have your backup plan and support system ready for Phase II. Yuying suggested to apply for sites that offers components that will make you happy and make the internship experience worth the challenge. Internship sites that are rated highly may not be a good fit for your needs. Khanh used the same strategies to apply for internships as she did for Ph.D. programs. She had her top choices and her backup sites, all of which she would have been happy with. Khanh suggested to apply to programs that will advance your training in some substantive way. Khanh saw the internship as an opportunity for a new adventure and to step out of her comfort zone. She was able to move to a new location, experience life in New Mexico, and meet new people.
- Yuying Tsong – President of Division 35 Section 5, Assistant Professor at California State University Fullerton
- Phi Loan Le – Founder of Division 35 Section 5, Training Director at Santa Ana College, Student Health and Wellness Center
- Khanh Dinh – President Elect of Division 35 Section 5, Associate Professor at University of Massachusetts Lowell
- Diane Hayashino – Past President of Division 35 Section 5, Training Director at California State University Long Beach
What was your most memorable experience on internship?
Each of our participants completed their internship at different sites. Phi Loan, Yuying and Diane completed their internship at university counseling centers (UCCs), while Khanh completed her internship at a consortium that included a VA hospital, Indian Health Services, and a university hospital.
Phi Loan said her internship experience was powerful. It was her first time working in a counseling center; the training, people, and connection that she made during that year convinced her to pursue a career as a university counseling center psychologist. Yuying said that she also loved her experience working at a counseling center. Her internship helped her to better understand the operations of an agency. She enjoyed connecting with the staff and fellow interns and working with diverse student populations. Diane had her internship at a counseling center during 9/11. She remembered that the event was traumatic and the staff members mobilized quickly to serve the students. The relationships she established and the support that she received at a counseling center was a great fit for her needs. She credited her training director, an Asian American woman, for supporting her through the experience. Khanh had a very different experience on her internship in New Mexico. The consortium had 4-5 different rotations. Her favorite rotation was with Indian Health Services on the reservation because she was interested in gaining more clinical experience with diverse populations.
What were some challenges in your internship experience?
Most of our participants indicated that completing the internship while working on their dissertation as a real challenge. Diane was in the midst of collecting data when she went on internship. Halfway through her internship year, she realized that she will not be able to finish her dissertation. She was embarrassed when she informed her family that she will have to delay graduation. Looking back, she realized now that she had put a lot of pressure on herself to finish her dissertation on time. Phi Loan also struggled with completing her dissertation while on internship. She chose to focus only on her internship experience. In retrospect, she wished that she had given her dissertation more attention. She said that it was hard to say “no” to many amazing opportunities and maintain balance.
Khanh said that one of her biggest challenges was working with Vietnam vets at the VA. As a Vietnamese refugee and a lesbian woman, her and her clients’ identities and traumatic experiences were highlighted in the therapeutic relationship. There were a few times when she felt unsafe with clients who were experiencing psychotic episodes. She said the VA staff members did not know how to address issues of diversity and discrimination. She experienced homophobia from her colleagues and did not feel that she had the power to interrupt offensive remarks as an intern. In addition, the location of the internship offered her and her partner very little opportunities to socialize with others. Finally, Khan said the regular work schedule was challenging. She is not a morning person and having to wake up early every day was difficult.
Yuying said that waking up early on a regular basis was also hard for her and that she was drawn to a faculty position because the work schedule was more flexible. Yuying also said that hunting for jobs while on internship was challenging. Looking back, she wished that she eased the pressure on herself about getting a full time job right after internship; instead, she would have taken time to get her license first.
What makes a successful applicant?
As a training directors, Diane and Phi Loan said that they get this question a lot and it may be a sign that students are feeling very stressed and anxious about the application process. Diane said she looks for applicants who are ready to make the transition from student to professional. She wants students to bring their whole selves to internship in addition to their strong clinical and research background. She is looking for students who are comfortable with themselves and a good match for the site. She recommends applicants to take time to research the site to get to know the training and staff members. College counseling centers are looking for interns who have clinical experiences with different populations, not just with college students. At a UCC, she is looking for interns who are flexible and adjust quickly between responsibilities (e.g., seeing clients, consulting with departments, running groups, and providing outreach). Phi Loan also agreed that flexibility is an important characteristic for successful interns. She is looking for interns who can find a balance between being themselves and being a professional and who can create authentic connections. Applicants who are invested in their own training stand out to her.
Both Khanh and Yuying emphasized the fit between the person and the site. Khanh found that being the only ethnic minority person with White supervisors was challenging. She suggested that culturally sensitive supervisors can make a difference on internship. Khanh really wanted clinical experiences with a diverse population and she targeted internship sites that would provide her with this training. Yuying acknowledged that “fit” can seem like a mysterious concept. She said that Khanh’s strategy of choosing practicum experiences that matched her clinical interest is a great example of fit. She said during her graduate work, she choose to participate in an extra year of practicum in a college counseling center in order to work with API college students. She recommended applicants to look for internship that fits with their training needs and interests rather than settling with an internship just to finish the program.
What other advice would you give to students applying for internship?
Take a deep breath, said Phi Loan, it is an anxiety provoking experience. This is part of the whole clinical training. Be intentional about looking for an internship that fits with your identities and career goals. Bring yourself to the application. Diane said that the cover letter makes an important first impression. Take some time to talk about why the site is attractive and how it fits with your training goals. Make sure someone else proof read your cover letters and essays. Have your backup plan and support system ready for Phase II. Yuying suggested to apply for sites that offers components that will make you happy and make the internship experience worth the challenge. Internship sites that are rated highly may not be a good fit for your needs. Khanh used the same strategies to apply for internships as she did for Ph.D. programs. She had her top choices and her backup sites, all of which she would have been happy with. Khanh suggested to apply to programs that will advance your training in some substantive way. Khanh saw the internship as an opportunity for a new adventure and to step out of her comfort zone. She was able to move to a new location, experience life in New Mexico, and meet new people.
Inspiration and Motivation in the Face of Challenges
November 2013
This months’ Conversation Circle question was: “What inspires you, motivates you, and sustains you in your work when things get challenging?” Our Conversation Circle participants were:
Using antifragility as inspiration. In his 2012 book “Antifragility,” Nassim Nicholas Taleb defined antifragility as a person’s ability to benefit from an adverse event. Antifragility is different from resilience. Resilience is a person’s ability to withstand shock and return to her original state of wellbeing after an adverse event. Antifragility is a person’s ability to become even stronger after an impact. For Zhen, antifragility is a source of inspiration and motivation. She reframes setbacks and challenges as opportunities to grow. This philosophy aligns well with her Christian faith and her belief that challenges can make us stronger.
Finding social support. Debra shared her experiences working with a very challenging supervisor. She said that finding support inside and outside of her institution helped her through the experience. Situations like this can be scary and traumatic because one may not have a lot of control over the outcome. For Debra, it was helpful to remember the difficult situation was temporary. She said that it took her a long time to recover from the experience afterwards. Phi Loan agreed that finding support from like-minded people who shared her values was necessary to help her cope with challenges because dealing with systemic oppression can be demoralizing. She said that sharing coping strategies with people who are going through the same experiences is a wonderful way to build relationships.
Remembering that we have multiple intersecting identities. Both Phi Loan and Yuying said that when things at work get tough, it is helpful to remember that they are more than their professional roles; their sense of pride also comes from their roles as a mothers, teachers, partner, friends, etc. Phi Loan said that her children ground her. When she comes home, her children help remind her to leave her work where it belongs. She would ask herself, “In the grand scheme of things, what are the most important things to me?” Both Phi Loan and Yuying said that re-evaluating their priorities help put challenges into perspective.
Taking time for self-care and self-reflection. Phi Loan emphasized self-care as a way to help her move on after dealing with challenges. She finds it helpful to have a place to get away. All participants agreed that it is rejuvenating to take time to reflect upon their original inspirations for becoming psychologists. For Phi Loan, she became passionate about psychology because she cared about underserved populations. Zhen said that it was her relationships with encouraging colleagues that motivated her to pursue research. Debra saw a need in her community and wanted to make the world a better place. Yuying said that it was her natural curiosity about people and relationships between people that sparked her interest in psychology. Khan said that the resilience of marginalized populations and the legacy of her ancestors inspires her every day.
- Yuying Tsong – President of Division 35 Section 5, Assistant Professor at California State University Fullerton
- Phi Loan Le – Founder of Division 35 Section 5, Training Director at Santa Ana College, Student Health and Wellness Center
- Debra Kawahara – 2013 Section 5 Pioneer Award Recipient, Associate Program Director at California School of Professional Psychology, Alliant International University
- Zhen Cheng – Student Representative of Division 35 Section 5, clinical psychology doctoral student at the University of Oregon
- Khanh Dinh – President Elect of Division 35 Section 5, Associate Professor at University of Massachusetts Lowell
Using antifragility as inspiration. In his 2012 book “Antifragility,” Nassim Nicholas Taleb defined antifragility as a person’s ability to benefit from an adverse event. Antifragility is different from resilience. Resilience is a person’s ability to withstand shock and return to her original state of wellbeing after an adverse event. Antifragility is a person’s ability to become even stronger after an impact. For Zhen, antifragility is a source of inspiration and motivation. She reframes setbacks and challenges as opportunities to grow. This philosophy aligns well with her Christian faith and her belief that challenges can make us stronger.
Finding social support. Debra shared her experiences working with a very challenging supervisor. She said that finding support inside and outside of her institution helped her through the experience. Situations like this can be scary and traumatic because one may not have a lot of control over the outcome. For Debra, it was helpful to remember the difficult situation was temporary. She said that it took her a long time to recover from the experience afterwards. Phi Loan agreed that finding support from like-minded people who shared her values was necessary to help her cope with challenges because dealing with systemic oppression can be demoralizing. She said that sharing coping strategies with people who are going through the same experiences is a wonderful way to build relationships.
Remembering that we have multiple intersecting identities. Both Phi Loan and Yuying said that when things at work get tough, it is helpful to remember that they are more than their professional roles; their sense of pride also comes from their roles as a mothers, teachers, partner, friends, etc. Phi Loan said that her children ground her. When she comes home, her children help remind her to leave her work where it belongs. She would ask herself, “In the grand scheme of things, what are the most important things to me?” Both Phi Loan and Yuying said that re-evaluating their priorities help put challenges into perspective.
Taking time for self-care and self-reflection. Phi Loan emphasized self-care as a way to help her move on after dealing with challenges. She finds it helpful to have a place to get away. All participants agreed that it is rejuvenating to take time to reflect upon their original inspirations for becoming psychologists. For Phi Loan, she became passionate about psychology because she cared about underserved populations. Zhen said that it was her relationships with encouraging colleagues that motivated her to pursue research. Debra saw a need in her community and wanted to make the world a better place. Yuying said that it was her natural curiosity about people and relationships between people that sparked her interest in psychology. Khan said that the resilience of marginalized populations and the legacy of her ancestors inspires her every day.
What to Look for in a Ph.D. Program
July 2013
The first Conversation Circle was held during the Division 35 Social at the APA Convention in Honolulu. This question was posed to the Circle by Lei Wang, who is a student at the University of Missouri: “What should I look for in a Ph.D. program?” Our Conversation Circle participants made up of the following participants:
What am I Looking For? During the initial phase of your search, think about your purpose for pursuing a graduate degree. Are you looking to conduct research or do clinical work after graduation? Research I universities are usually heavily research oriented, whereas PsyD programs are mostly clinically focused. Look at the milestones in the manual for current students to get a sense of the focus of the program. The program milestones include qualifying projects or exams, portfolio items, clinical case presentations, etc. Check out where students usually match for internship. For example, counseling psychology students have a high rate of match with University Counseling Centers. Is working with college students something you are interested in doing?
Funding. Funding is a major concern for graduate students. Remember, psychologists do not make a huge amount of money after graduation. Be mindful of how much loans you take out. Don’t invest in a career that you cannot afford. Some students who attend programs without funding find themselves with limited career choices afterwards. For example, some students who have a lot of debt are limited to VA positions because of the positions pay high salaries. In addition, some loan payback programs send graduates to rural areas. Will you be happy working for the VA and/or in rural areas at the start of your career? For programs and universities that do not provide full funding, you will have to be resourceful and creative in those situations to find funding for yourself. There may be great teaching and research assistantships available. For example, disability services and College Bound programs may have positions that will provide funding and opportunities to gain relevant work experiences.
Location, Location, Location. The location of the program and the dynamics within the department can be just as important as the caliber of the program. Check out the demographic representation in the university and the town. Being an underrepresented student in a small and homogenous town can be really hard for 4+ years. Email the program secretary to get connected with current students and ask the students questions that you cannot find on the website (e.g. What is their working relationship like with their advisor? What is the working style of their faculty? What do they hope to do after grad school? How do they like living in the city/town? How do they meet their financial need?). You can email faculty with questions too but know that they are sometimes be too busy to reply.
Who do you work with? Mentorship can sometimes make or break the graduate experience. Some students work with famous advisors who are too busy to be a good mentor. Some programs have peer mentorship systems that match an incoming student with an advanced student.
Specific Concerns. If you are an international student, look for a program or campus that is knowledgeable about international students’ circumstances (e.g. student visas). There are no loans available for international students. Therefore, funding becomes a much more salient issue. The representation of international students in programs or campus varies by geographic location. This might mean the difference between being the only international student in your program or campus and being part of a larger international student community that can support you.
Interview Phase. During the interview phase, take a look at the relationships between the students and between students and faculty, which can be telling of the overall graduate experience that you will have. Are you a student who thrives in a competitive environment or a collaborative one? Do you need a lot of support from your peers and mentors, or are you very independent? Read between the lines of what the students are sharing. Be mindful of what they are not sharing. Ask about other perks such as funding for conferences and research-related travels. At this phase of the application process, you are interviewing the program as much as they are interviewing you.
- Yuying Tsong – President of Division 35 Section 5, Assistant Professor at California State University, Fullerton
- Linh Luu – Ph.D. student in at Lehigh University
- Dominique Malebranche – Ph.D. student at University of Missouri-Columbia
- Phi Loan Le – Founder of Division 35 Section 5 and Training Director at Santa Ana College, Student Health and Wellness Center
- Jennifer Chain – Ph.D. student at University of Oregon
What am I Looking For? During the initial phase of your search, think about your purpose for pursuing a graduate degree. Are you looking to conduct research or do clinical work after graduation? Research I universities are usually heavily research oriented, whereas PsyD programs are mostly clinically focused. Look at the milestones in the manual for current students to get a sense of the focus of the program. The program milestones include qualifying projects or exams, portfolio items, clinical case presentations, etc. Check out where students usually match for internship. For example, counseling psychology students have a high rate of match with University Counseling Centers. Is working with college students something you are interested in doing?
Funding. Funding is a major concern for graduate students. Remember, psychologists do not make a huge amount of money after graduation. Be mindful of how much loans you take out. Don’t invest in a career that you cannot afford. Some students who attend programs without funding find themselves with limited career choices afterwards. For example, some students who have a lot of debt are limited to VA positions because of the positions pay high salaries. In addition, some loan payback programs send graduates to rural areas. Will you be happy working for the VA and/or in rural areas at the start of your career? For programs and universities that do not provide full funding, you will have to be resourceful and creative in those situations to find funding for yourself. There may be great teaching and research assistantships available. For example, disability services and College Bound programs may have positions that will provide funding and opportunities to gain relevant work experiences.
Location, Location, Location. The location of the program and the dynamics within the department can be just as important as the caliber of the program. Check out the demographic representation in the university and the town. Being an underrepresented student in a small and homogenous town can be really hard for 4+ years. Email the program secretary to get connected with current students and ask the students questions that you cannot find on the website (e.g. What is their working relationship like with their advisor? What is the working style of their faculty? What do they hope to do after grad school? How do they like living in the city/town? How do they meet their financial need?). You can email faculty with questions too but know that they are sometimes be too busy to reply.
Who do you work with? Mentorship can sometimes make or break the graduate experience. Some students work with famous advisors who are too busy to be a good mentor. Some programs have peer mentorship systems that match an incoming student with an advanced student.
Specific Concerns. If you are an international student, look for a program or campus that is knowledgeable about international students’ circumstances (e.g. student visas). There are no loans available for international students. Therefore, funding becomes a much more salient issue. The representation of international students in programs or campus varies by geographic location. This might mean the difference between being the only international student in your program or campus and being part of a larger international student community that can support you.
Interview Phase. During the interview phase, take a look at the relationships between the students and between students and faculty, which can be telling of the overall graduate experience that you will have. Are you a student who thrives in a competitive environment or a collaborative one? Do you need a lot of support from your peers and mentors, or are you very independent? Read between the lines of what the students are sharing. Be mindful of what they are not sharing. Ask about other perks such as funding for conferences and research-related travels. At this phase of the application process, you are interviewing the program as much as they are interviewing you.